We have several changes planned for Battlegrounds in the next minor content patch and would like to share them with you now. This patch will be available for public testing and we encourage you to participate, queue up and provide some feedback on these changes.

• Firstly, say goodbye to Battleground Marks of Honor. We feel this currency system is a bit outdated and are getting rid of it. Any items which require these marks as currency will have their costs adjusted appropriately to remove this requirement. The quest NPCs will still be available to award players Honor for turning in leftover marks, including individual Marks of Honor if a player has more marks from one Battleground than another, but this is only to help players clear this expired currency.
  
  
• Next, the Battleground holiday weekend will now be denoted as "Call to Arms" in the Battleground tab and Calendar. If you prefer a specific Battleground over all others, look for those words next to its name to determine whether or not you'll receive bonus Honor. The bonus awards for Call to Arms Battlegrounds have been adjusted.
  
  
  • Winning a Call to Arms Battleground for the first time in a day will award players with 30 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency and 25 Arena points.
    
  • Additional Call to Arms Battleground victories after the first win for a player that day will award them with 15 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency.
    
  • Losing a Call to Arms Battleground will award players with 5 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency.
  
  
• To bring the rate at which players obtain PvP rewards with Honor more in-line with the rate at which players obtain PvE rewards via the Dungeon Finder, we'll also be increasing the amount of Honor awarded for an Honorable Kill by 100%. In light of this, the amount of experience provided from an Honorable Kill, and the amount of Honor awarded for completing the Wintergrasp weekly quests, have been reduced by 50%.
  
  It's important to note one thing about these 50% decreases. All Honor awarded for completing objectives in Battlegrounds and Wintergrasp is actually based on an Honorable Kill conversion rate. So if you destroy a tower in Alterac Valley for example, the Honor you're awarded is actually based on a flat number of Honorable Kills. Since Honorable Kills will now award 100% more Honor, completing such objectives will also award more Honor. This is why experience gains based on completing Battleground objectives and Honor awarded from the Wintergrasp quests are being decreased by 50%.
  
  
• Now that we hopefully have your attention, we're pleased to announce the implementation of the Random Battleground system! This system will work virtually the same as the Random Dungeon option in the Dungeon Finder and will replace the Battleground daily quests. Players can queue solo, or with a group of up to five players for a Random Battleground in the Battleground tab. As with the Random Dungeon option, the Battleground chosen will not be revealed until players zone into the Battleground for which they are selected. The bonus rewards for this system are identical to the updated Call to Arms bonuses.
  
  
  • Winning a Battleground using the Random Battleground option for the first time in a day will award players with 30 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency and 25 Arena points.
    
  • Winning additional Battlegrounds using the Random Battleground option after the first random win will award players with 15 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency.
    
  • Losing a Battleground using the Random Battleground option will award players with 5 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency.
    
  • When using the Random Battleground option, players will not receive additional rewards if the Battleground chosen is under the effects of the Call to Arms bonuses. In other words, the bonuses do not stack. In addition, if a player has been rewarded 30 Honorable Kills worth of bonus Honor currency and 25 Arena points from either the Random Battleground system, or the Call to Arms Battleground, he or she will be rewarded 15 Honorable Kills worth of bonus Honor currency and no Arena points that day for each additional victory. This applies whether the Random Battleground system is used, or the Call to Arms Battleground is chosen specifically, as a player cannot be rewarded the full amount of bonus Honor and the 25 Arena points more than once per day.

All of these features and changes will be available in the next minor patch which should be hitting the public test realms in the near future. Please help us out by testing this system and providing your feedback so we can make some fine-tuning adjustments before the patch's release.

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Q u o t e:
WHY on earth would you ever reduce the incentive for completing objectives when the BIGGEST problem with BGs currently is the lack of people doing the objectives?

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The incentive doesn't change. Increasing the Honor awarded for Honorable Kills by 100% increases the Honor awarded from kills and completing objectives by a flat and equal rate. In the next patch you'll get proportionately more for doing both.

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Q u o t e:
This business about honor / xp awarded for completing objectives is based on a fixed HK metric is kind of wierd.

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This is how the internal calculation system has always worked ever since Battlegrounds were first introduced. Whenever you're awarded Honor for anything other than an Honorable Kill, the game is actually giving you X number of Honorable Kills worth of Honor. So again, increasing the amount of Honor gained from Honorable Kills by 100% increases Honor gained equally across the boards.

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Q u o t e:
The reason there is so much random field / road killing and less objectives being completed is because the safety net that HKs provide. It's great that they increased the amount of honor gained from completing objectives, but it increase at the same ratio as HKs!!! There is no additional motivation for someone to stop HK farming in the middle of WSG than there was before.

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This may be your experience, but these changes will not increase the incentive to farm kills by any means. In most cases, the most efficient ways of gaining Honor through Battlegrounds is to complete objectives and complete them fast. This has always been true.

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Q u o t e:
As a matter of fact, there might even be less motivation for the sub-lvl 80 brackets because there is less XP to be had from objectives.

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Players should not notice a decrease in the amount of experience they receive by completing objectives in Battlegrounds in this new patch. We want to award more Honor in Battlegrounds, but we feel the amount of experience earned is pretty close to where we want it. The two changes being made should accomplish both awarding more Honor in Battlegrounds and keeping experience gains where they are.

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Q u o t e:
How does this tie into the "rated battlegrounds" that have been talked about? When you select a random BG are you going to be put up against opposing teams with equivalent ratings?

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We'll touch upon that more further down the road when we start discussing more information about Cataclysm. For now, we're really happy with the idea of bringing the random system to Battlegrounds and providing extra incentive to go that route.

A lot of players are asking about the daily quests and Arena points rewarded for completing them. Yes, as with the dungeon daily quests, the Battleground daily quests will be going away in place of the new Random Battleground option. Players will be awarded Arena points as well. I'm working on confirming the additional Arena point rewards and apologize for not having that information in the original post.

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Q u o t e:
Hey Zarhym, remember me from 3.3.2 - Where Next?



What character should I send the cake to?

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I do remember that. I wanted so badly to just tell you then. ;)

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Q u o t e:
I have a question about the LFBG system:

Will your group be paired with other groups? Are you guaranteed to be facing another 5-player LFBG group on the other team? Will the rest of the roster also be filled with LFBG groups or can they be PUGs?

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The system will pull players from the Random Battleground queue and the queues for each specific Battleground. It will try to match players according to gear with some leniency involved, but it's not going to try and pair set parties with, or against other set parties. That doesn't mean it couldn't happen though.

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Q u o t e:


I know ppl have already asked this, but a blue hasn't address this question yet. so heres hoping.

what about items that only use only marks like mounts or tabards? will there be a conversion to HKs, and if so what will be that conversion ratio?

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Many people are asking this, but it's quite clearly stated that any items which require marks as a currency will have the requirements adjusted, likely in the form of Honor. I do not have a breakdown for every item that can be purchased with Marks of Honor and how their costs will change, but I can assure you the test realms will be available in the near future for players to check this out.

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Q u o t e:
Will I be able to queue for the LFBG and LFD at the same time?

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No, we want to refrain from providing this option to players. It essentially guarantees in most cases that players will be ditching either a dungeon group, or a Battleground team as soon as their preferred form of game play is available to them. In addition, while players can queue for two Battlegrounds at once, players may not queue for a specific Battleground if they are queued for the Random Battleground.

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Q u o t e:


We only fail at math assuming your 3rd point, "experience is based on honor", is true. I'm not saying you're wrong, it's just that obviously many of us didn't know that. Can you, or a blue, provide the proof?

As it stands now:
HK offers X honor and Y xp
Objective gives equal points as Z HK's
WG quests give equal honor as Z HK's

As these notes read:
HK's will offer X*2 honor and Y/2 xp
Objectives will give equal points as Z HK's (double Honor and half XP)
WG quests give equal honor as Z/2 HK's (equal Honor)

So as I understand Zarhym, means that there will be a trade-off of bonus honor to replace the reduced XP.

Again, I could be wrong, and believe me I would love to be wrong, but I would need some proof that XP is based from honor instead of a static number per HK.

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The post you quoted is true. Experience gains are based off of Honor gains which are based off of Honorable Kills. So I'll re-quote the post you did confirming the math is correct:

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Q u o t e:
You get 100% experience now.
Honor is doubling.
Experience is based on honor.
You now get 200% experience.
They don't want to buff experience, just honor, so experience is being reduced by 50%
50% is one half.
One half of 200% is 100%
200 - 100 = 100
You will get 100% experience after.

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Q u o t e:
Hi Zarhym,

With the rate of honor gain increasing, will the maximum amount of honor able to be kept at once increase from 75k to a higher amount? It's always felt a little low, and will probably feel even more so now.

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The current plan is to leave the honor cap at 75,000. This could change depending on testing and evaluation.

I'll be sure to update the original post, but for those asking:

• 25 Arena points will be awarded for the first victory of the day through the Random Battleground system or Call to Arms Battleground.
  
• Yes, players can turn in leftover individual Marks of Honor to the same quest giver for a reduced amount of Honor.

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Q u o t e:
So, essentially you are going to take away the already minimal reward we get from doing Wintergrasp, unless you happen to be everywhere, doing everything in every single WG you are in. From a "casual" PVP perspective, I dislike this change. I don't like PVP for the most part, the idea of BG's kinda sucks, just doing the exact same thing in a very small enclosed space, over and over again is lame. I like Wintergrasp because its out in the open, and pretty much anything could happen. Why would you change the rewards to make it less appealing?

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I'm trying to be as clear as possible about this. Anytime you are awarded Honor for anything, the game is actually giving you an amount of Honor based on an Honorable Kill conversion rate. This is why when I explained the rewards for participating in Random Battlegrounds in my original post, I told you that you would get Z number of Honorable Kills worth of Honor.

So as for the Wintergrasp weekly quests, look at it like this:

• Each Wintergrasp quest rewards you with Z number of Honorable Kills worth of Honor.
  
  
• Because we are increasing the amount of Honor an Honorable Kill awards players by 100%, these quests would then provide Z x 2 number of Honorable Kills worth of Honor.
  
  
• We don't want to double the Honor rewards players receive from the quests, so we are cutting the number of Honorable Kills worth of Honor you will receive for each Wintergrasp quest in half.
  
  
• The net result is no change to the total amount of Honor you will receive when completing each Wintergrasp quest. You will, however, get twice as much Honor for each objective you complete and each Honorable Kill you earn.

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Q u o t e:
uhm i cant read all 17 pages so idk if this has been asked yet or not..

will this take effect SOON. as in will this actually affect me in game within the next month? or is this purely going on the ptr for cataclysm?

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This is for the next minor content patch 3.3.3 which will be hitting the public test realms in the coming days. Per usual, I'm unable to provide a specific patch date, but this patch will be available long before Cataclysm. ;)

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Q u o t e:
How about XP? He sounded like it was getting nerfed again.

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I'm not going to repeat myself explaining the conversion rate again. You're welcome to click on each "Blizz" symbol next to my posts to learn more. If you're not interested in that, let me just say that the Honorable Kill buff coupled with the experience gains nerf result in no change to the amount of experience one will be awarded in a Battleground.

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Q u o t e:


awesome you actually read them all! >.>

now whats blizzards plan with the honor cap? i personally even tho im casual pvp never buy one peice at a time, i farm up 75k honor and as many marks as i can before i hit the cap then buy a peice and hopefully another with turn ins. this is a completely valid system, it provides those who dont win often the ability to still get good amount of honor while not as quickly as those who win.

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I stated it earlier in this thread, but we don't currently plan to raise the Honor cap. We'll see how things pan out on the test realms and potentially reevaluate this system, though I make no promises that a change will be made.

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Q u o t e:
XP reduction again....not happy with this. this is the second nerf on XP gains in the BGs

not all players are human or BoA loaded to gain extra XP. i'm tired of questing and liked the alteranative of XP in BGs and DF.

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I've explained it numerous times in this thread and will do so again in as few words as possible.

Honor for completing objectives being doubled + experience gained for completing Honor objectives cut in half = no change in the amount of experience gained.

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Q u o t e:
You've let implementation details leak through into this announcement Zarhym and that's the source of a bunch of confusion. Rather than trying to explain those details, I suggest just omitting the details completely.

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I assumed knowledge was power.